This is the forum archive of Homey. For more information about Homey, visit the Official Homey website.
The Homey Community has been moved to https://community.athom.com.
This forum is now read-only for archive purposes.
The Homey Community has been moved to https://community.athom.com.
This forum is now read-only for archive purposes.
Comments
So come up with ideas/suggestions instead of only shouting no to something you don't know to what you are saying no
I try to be reasonable, and supports all claims form non Athom employees that it is gonna be just fine. But we'd like some feedback that our concerns are being heard.
So far, I feel like the silent treatment is given..
And it's what is said not what isn't.
well... in his update post he did mention:
Well there goes the web-interface
My question was about if I was screwd with my windows 10 devices.
The only thing I come up with, reading everything:
Yes, most likely you are.
Still im not planning on buying an android/IOS device just for Homey....
we from the Boston Redskins.. lel
.. I've red the blog, well thats said.
This company just lost a promoter.
But eh, we will see, A fair bit of backers already got a slap in the face we can take another one.
It all will be wonderfull on a android / IOS device...
I think I leave this topic,, no point on discussing since there is no discussion.
Mobile is great for media consumption, quick thingies and social interaction.
Desktop is for content creation, complex stuff, powerful stuff.
I totally agree a good mobile app is very very important.
But, creating complex flows, configuration etc? On a mobile device? NO, NO, NO.
For me it would be a reason to sell my Homey and go back to the Vera platform where I have a choice and where they cherish their power users...
Homey is not only reading temperature or controlling lights. Homey also means programming (creating and maintaining flows). Now, as for controlling lights and so on, I agree that you need a mobile app. If you are away from home you need to be able to access your homey.
However, I would be annoyed (understatement) if I have to create flows on my 5.5" screen and thick fingers.
Let us make a deal:
If we need to programm the homey on a mobile then I think it is fair that Athom will develop for homey too on a mobile.
Please show pictures of your workspace where you all are programming on your mobile, where you write your documents on a mobile.
And after one day you will come back on your (stupid) idea.
Now I really wonder if you people at Athom have a homey at home with a lot of flows. Do you really?
I can't imagine that you want to recreate all the flows on a mobile.
I don't know if I am pissed and/or very disappointed (again)
Maybe people use mobiles for social media, for video's etc etc.. And they spend more time and bandwith on their phone then on their desktops nowadays but maybe the reason is partly the inefficiency of browsing/working on mobiles. I know I can't work/live/control without my dekstop/laptop...
But claiming "I don't know if I am pissed and/or very disappointed (again)" is a bit early, isn't it? We first have to see what Athom comes up with... I'm sure we'll be suprised...They all don't have desktop apps.
They do provide apps that are killing it tho, and easy to use.
The blogpost does clarify a bit, and i kinda understand their move to mobile indeed.
But i'd like to hang back and see how the mobile app turns out. As far as i know, for now 2.0.0 only brings api keys and the new mobile interfaces. So updating inmediatly isn't really nessecary, maybe someone in the meantime can create a desktop app using their new API
Yes i understand that there are people who don't have a laptop or PC in there house any-more. And yes i understand that a big portion of the customers will buy homey as a gadget and never have more then 10 devices and 3-4 flows. So that its essential to be able to add devices and make basic flows from tablets and mobile phones. And yes it is more easy to setup devices with an ipad or mobile phone then to drag your desktop pc true the house connecting buildin Zwave devices. And yes i do understand that when you have configured homey most users will probably use the mobile app more then the web interface or desktop app to control lights etc.
Its no debate that homey needs a better off the shelve app than it has now. Proven by the fact that you have 1.1k reactions on the homey dash app that fills a gab left by the homey app. And the fact that you can't even add devices to homey from the current app.
But and this is a big but.
There also is a group that does not use homey as a gadget but is using homey for what its great at. The one thing that homey does better than all the speaking home assistant things from google, amazone, apple and samsung. Providing a fairly open platform that ties all network connected devices together and make them work as one. Making your home truly smart. The possibility to control every device from every device.
Forget the stupid voice control, forget the i'm sitting in a chair pull up my mobile phone app to turn on a light. If you want to do just that there a far more cheaper ways by company's making far better apps. The power of homey is that you can connect everything and tie them together with flows.
Lets be honest. If you have 50 + connected devices and as many flows you just don't want to manage them by your mobile phone. You don't setup a smarthouse with a tablet or mobile phone the same way as you don't program programs of write reports on a mobile phone. Those are screens perfect for consuming data, but they are not made for complex tasks.
You want that kickass high resolution screen and keyboard and mouse to be able to setup those flows as efficient as you can. And if you are working on your pc you don't want to reach to your mobile phone to be able to control a light you want your pc to be connected to homey and be able to control those devices from your pc.
A device that is made to connect all devices no matter the techniques they use to communicate that has no interface to be controlled from a PC is a car without wheels.
And @Emile i'm sorry the then don't update argument? To quote Todd Hoffman Are you freaking kidding me !?! The founder of a software company in home automation tells there customers a week after Petya to keep running old software!?!
You make a product that controls our houses! for crying out loud. As a software company you should always tell if not force your customers to keep there software up to date to protect those customers and no only them but also yourself.
What do you think will happen with athom if that microphone or those connected IP camera's get hacked or all lights start blinking in the middle of the night. Then its all over, your customers trust you enough to let your software control there homes if that trust is broken homey is just a white ball with a ledring..
And if you need your community to tell you that then it might be time to get out of your bubble grow up and start listening..
To be honest I don't see the problem with removing the web interface. Comparing the configuration of Homey with writing letters or programming code is nonsens. With Homey it's all about drag and drop. The are no large texts to write or huge overviews to display. So I think it could be perfect for a native app. The app concept needs, of course, a complete rework. But I honestly think it could work perfectly fine.
Nest, Logitech Harmony, Homewizard, etc work like this and they work perfect. I agree that we should have the discussion around how it should work and not if we should do it. Let's discuss some situations where you can definitely not use an app. I'm really interested in these use cases.
"a 16 year old boy is going to work at Athom, i am sure he can't code. He will be gone before winter etc. etc." (<- Vooroordelen)
That isn't much different then:
"Athom drops desktop support, i am not going to use my phone or tablet. That means i am going to sell my Homey if they do"
But I guess this is just another thing with Athom, the issues I already had with Homey and now this.
When I bought it, it could be programmed by a PC/Tablet with Chrome browser. Later they say it can only be programmed by their PC app. And now they say that in the next major version it can only programmed by a phone (on top of that only android and ios).
I have the android app 'Automate it pro'. It kind of has the same thing: triggers and actions. However, the structure is way less complex than homey. In homey you have apps with settings like better logic, states, countdown etc.
That means you need to add variables, switch back to the flows, use them etc.
Right now you just open multiple tabs where you can work on the variables and the flows at the same time. Nice with mouse and keyboard.
The phone can never beat a PC in user friendlyness.
I bought that 'thing' due to its potential and knowing how I can use it. Now they limit this usage. Can I get a refund?
And as others have said about the response of Athom on the critisism: "You don't have to upgarde to V2.0".
Wow! The product is far from finished (a lot not working yet). And they go into another direction (limiting the way you can use homey) and they say: take it or leave it? Feels like throwing us the finger right in front of our face.
Yes, this morning I said to my girlfriend: They experience I have had with Homey and now this, I wouldn't have bought homey if I knew on forehand. I would have bought another system.
What I am concerned about however is that the current UI/UX is developer driven and not (UI/UX) designer driven.
I really hope a UI/UX designer gets the last word and NOT a developer, that's in my opinion the biggest hurdle Athom has to take and a descision for @emile and @stefan to make.
I have MacBooks, iPads, iPhone, etc. The reason I have my tablet always close to me is exactly the user friendliness. Push the power button, launch the homey app, adjust your flow, done!
The phone itself is user friendly itself by its size, fine. But as far as an application goes, you can create a more user friendly application on a PC/Tablet (with e.g. Windows 10) than on a phone.
Let me put it in a way you might understand: You can duplicate every phone application on a PC (when it doesn't need the SIM card or some sensors), but you cannot duplicate every PC application on a phone.
In other words, on a PC you have more options to satisfy your user regarding user friendlyness.
Can you open multiple windows at a time (ok, in Android you now have split screen, but wow on a 5.5" screen)
You have a lets say 25" screen at your hands, where you can have much more info.
Typing on a phone is a disaster (at least it is for me)
Another try: Do you think that a text editor like MS Word or Google docs is more user friendly on a phone than on a PC?
And the latter is a web application, but still way better operable on a PC than on a phone.
Like others have said: A phone is ideal for a lot of stuff, but not for programming.
And by the way, great that you have a tablet running ios or android. But I have a Windows 10 tablet. So I am shit out of luck?
My goodness, thinking of hours building flows on a 5" screen. I already get a headache thinking about it. Cramp in my fingers and sore eyes looking at those tiny letters...brrrr
If windows 10 isnt supported,, I need to buy another device just to operate homey. That ain't happening. So I got an expensive paperweight..
And for the sake of argument, dont start comparing Homey with setting up a logiteg harmony...and second,, I did didge my homewizzard for a reason.
How about running android in a Virtual Machine (like VirtualBox)? Would that be an option for you?
This, together with the remarks Lubbert already mentioned I guess we will have to wait and see how things turn out.
Oh and yes, I have a PC that I love to use
Desktop is all about keeping oversight. My desktop PC is a NUC; they do not come very much smaller. My monitor is 42 inch, and no I'm not completely blind (yet).
Desktops are all about comfort, like using an air-conditioning when its hot outside. Yes I know, many people say they don't need air-conditioning since they live in the Netherlands. My simple response to that; you probably don't need heating in wintertime? Desktops have been declared dead regularly the last 10 years, it makes you wonder why most serious users prefer them for serious work...
For setting up Homey. It should be doable to use a VM. But for switching my lights it's somewhat to much of a workaround.
It's all piling up.
First there where the nrf's for the geek backers to get my sensors working I had to diverd to a workaround (mysensors)
Now a workaround to get Homey itself Workin. Whats next?
Do you need to see 60 devices in one view when creating a flow? I don't think so. Maybe you can see floor>type>device and then there are 4 devices to choose from. That's extremely fast to use, but needs a complete redesign of the interface. I fully agree that writing a story on an iPhone is not ideal (although I'm writing it at the beach at the moment), but creating a flow doesn't need to be a keyboard or mouse intensive task. I think designing and thinking about the flow is 90% of the effort. Putting it in the system should be a matter of minutes. Also with an iPhone app.
All is of course depending on the UX designer, but I'm 100% confident that it can be done.
Let's have the discussion on how it could be done and come up with some concrete examples of your fears, so we can think about solutions.
So my recommendation to Athom is pretty straightforward:
- by all means, continue to improve the smartphone apps
- but please, please... keep supporting the desktop app (or Chrome browser) as well, and offer the same functionality there... for those of us who greatly dislike using smartphone apps for these kind of things.
[Edit] link to the poll removed... I discovered that it's possible to just vote multiple times in this poll... and I see 1 user already voted at least 9 times... which makes this poll completely useless, and its results utterly unreliable.
It's actually sad that some people believe this kind of childish behavior is helping anyone...
Harmony desktop app doesn't support the setup for any smarthome or bluetooth devices.
It's actually just for importing the regular profiles (wich is for now just around 33% of the functionality the remote has)
So ye, for you just IR might do the job, but i use bluetooth and smarthome buttons as well. So i am forced to setup trough their app.
I looked into HomeKit yesterday, wich ofcourse is only configureable by phone or tablet. They do have some kind of flows in there wich work pretty easy as well. (Ofcourse it's lacking allot of functionality homey has)
And I hardly ever use my smartphone (that's my whole point here!), so yeah, that part I don't miss at all.