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for Emile - Athom

Dear Emile,

Every updaye you annouch it as a great positive update with features and bugfixes, but based on my own experience and reading the forum all updates after version 0.89 are far from positive.

Kaku doesnt work, Flows dissapear, IR removed, Fibaru (Roller shutter 2) doenst work, Dutch speech doesnt work. , and I can go on based on the feedback I read in the forum.

Now I don't doubt the best intention you have for Athom/Homey, but it seems you lost the attention for the voices of your backers.
We are having problems and no solutions are coming or acknowleged, instead of changing all kinds of stuff, why not first pay attention to your backers and their problems.

To be honest, if you give the possibility to send back the Homey with the refund of my money I will do this immediately the way it looks now. 
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Comments

  • I forgot.... @Emile ;
  • lubbertkramerlubbertkramer Member
    edited September 2016
    @SdR All updates from 0.8.39 (4 in total) are experimental instead of stable and i think it's always a great update but with the updates on the kernel and the rewrites new problems will come and we will keep that until Athom releases 1.0 and even then updates can break thinks, look at the bigger software companies

    Wich version are you running on your Homey because in the last update 0.10 from friday IR is added/activated or how you will name it and it was deactivated in 0.9.1 and you are talking about 0.89 -> https://firmware.athom.com/
  • Strange, that some people have such negative experiences with homey.
    The only thing that not works for me after update 0.10.0, is speech recognition and the ' time earlier than' component.
    But... it's experimental software and not retail.

    And, i think people with negative experiences are more likely to tell this to the forum than people with positive experiences.
  • @lubbertkramer I am aware of the beta phase, but hiding behind this as excuse not the way to ignore the shared problems.
    I am now running 0.10 and as mentioned I have had al versions but all updates after 0.89 basicly made mine Homey useless, so if i could rollback I would but this is not possible.

    its not me or IR that needs focus but the shared issues, all updates after 0.89 degraded the stability of the experimental phase while it should be the other way around.
    there are no new problems with but still old excisting problems.
  • KoenMartensKoenMartens Backer - Super Early Bird
    @SdR: are you aware of the 'experimental' tag as well? Literally copied from the homey settings:

    Subscribe to experimental updates. Warning: these might be unstable!

    If you wanted a stable product, don't use experimental updates. As @lubbertkramer told you, there have been no stable updates from 0.89 on yet. 
    So really, the only thing that you are pissed about is that you cannot roll back to a different firmware setting. While this is annoying, IMO, you should have thought about that before you signed up for experimental settings instead of completely singling out a single person and making him feel bad for your own stupidity. This is not called for, as @Emile with the rest of Athom is doing a great job in improving Homey in these hard times.
  • TheoDeKoningTheoDeKoning Backer - First Batch
    @KoenMartens 
    About stupidity.

    Do not get me started. (Breek me de bek niet open.)



  • Fire69Fire69 Backer - Geek Edition
    @KoenMartens : I agree.
    It's experimental, you chose to install it, real to live with the consequences of your decisions...

    You're all acting like it's the apocalypse... 
    Learn to manage your expectations  ;)

    You have all been forcing Athom to release a firmware (on firmware Friday that was invented by the people that are now complaining the most). 
    When they don't release on Friday you blame them of breaking another deadline (that doesn't exist!)

    Give them some days to look at the problems. For all you now they just forgot to put a } somewhere! 
  • bvdbosbvdbos Moderator, Backer - Geek Edition
    Give them some days to look at the problems. For all you now they just forgot to put a } somewhere!
    The issue with Dutch Language is probably something like this... The same with multiple IR-devices...

  • MHubertMHubert Member
    edited September 2016
    Did all you guys forgot there wasn't a "beta/stable" for more then 3 months?

    Because of that a lot of apps and/or new features(ZWaves) didn't work anymore and a lot of users were forced!! to use this so called "free choice stupid donkey" Experimental firmware?

    For example simple ZWaves apps as Fibaro have ">=0.9.3". 
    ZWaves re-write was brought as a big game changer and to use it and get more compatiblitie of app, users needed to upgrade to Experimental.
    One small update like
    "0.8.39, Various improvements"
    as
    "0.9.4 beta/stable",
    could have prevented a big number is complaining people.

    Further it's a big laughing to see the major community splice :joy: 
  • bvdbosbvdbos Moderator, Backer - Geek Edition
    MHubert said:
    ...
    Yep, you're correct on this...
    Further it's a big laughing to see the major community splice joy
    I have other laughs...
  • [quote]Because of that a lot of apps and/or new features(ZWaves) didn't work anymore and a lot of users were forced!![/]

    Ehm.. Nobody was forced? People felt that forced because some features they wanted to test.
  • @jjtbsomhorst ;
    Ofcourse nobody is FORCED.
    Butt when one boght some Zwaves sensors becaus of the anounced rewrite, that persoon wants to use it.
    Only chooce then is too go 2 experimental.
  • If you went experimental you can expect things to break. No offence, but if you would install IOS 11 in this alpha stage i'm sure nothings works as it should. Athom is still in the development phase to "1.0" and using the community to test the new  software in order to get there.

    Nevertheless i still love the product and think it should succeed. The team on the other side needs to have a different approach on testing and probably needs to community. 
  • KoenMartensKoenMartens Backer - Super Early Bird
    edited September 2016
    MHubert said:
    @jjtbsomhorst ;
    Ofcourse nobody is FORCED.
    Butt when one boght some Zwaves sensors becaus of the anounced rewrite, that persoon wants to use it.
    Only chooce then is too go 2 experimental.
    Then you're making a concious choice between stability and new functionality. If you choose for one, don't complain that you don't get the other as well.
  • DieterKoblenzDieterKoblenz Member
    edited September 2016
    MHubert said:
    [...] a lot of users were forced!! [...]
    MHubert said:
    [...] Ofcourse nobody is FORCED. [...]
    .... it has similarities with my Android phone. I love new features and install custom roms to test these out. Sometimes I install a shitty rom because I want to test out new stuff. Now z-wave is important for a lot of users but that is their thing. They could have waited for a couple of days to see how things land but instead the moment experimental software came out they hit upgrade. If you can't handle resets and bugs as a user, wait for stable even if it takes bloody long. 
  • I have no Homey, so no complaining :)
  • MHubertMHubert Member
    edited September 2016
    @DieterKoblenz ;;;
    After instal of shitty ROM, you do rollback to former version not?

    ----
    People waiting for 3 month for stable release, dats no patients? 
    People boght new device for €299 ent want to get is new features and better working. Sjould the wait much more for stable? If I by a Beta Tesla ModelS with crashing monitor then I shoult eksept that ent not ekspect update soon of Tesla because it beta?

    Big fun here and heaven for the startups/big-kompanies :)

    Waiting/looking 2,5 jears for Homey ent still not wurth the money.

    Luving the risponse of Annemarie on slack.
  • JaapPeltJaapPelt Backer - Homey
    SdR said:
    @lubbertkramer I am aware of the beta phase, but hiding behind this as excuse not the way to ignore the shared problems.
    I am now running 0.10 and as mentioned I have had al versions but all updates after 0.89 basicly made mine Homey useless, so if i could rollback I would but this is not possible.

    its not me or IR that needs focus but the shared issues, all updates after 0.89 degraded the stability of the experimental phase while it should be the other way around.
    there are no new problems with but still old excisting problems.
    Even though we are a bunch of Homey fanboys, we should also be sympathetic towards users with a negative experience such as SdR. It cannot be denied that things break and cause problems. Some of us don't mind, but others do.

    I really hope that the community has helped you with at least some of your issues and that you feel supported. For me, the community has been the biggest joy. Most of the reactions seem to downplay your experience, but I don't think that is justified, so I just wanted to say that I do understand your position.
  • I just bought a Fibaro Push Button and wanna get it working  :'( :'(
  • Doesn't it work?
  • HansieNLHansieNL Member
    edited September 2016
  • ArjanArjan Member
    edited September 2016
    Did you create a Github issue?

    Would also send a log with the issue, they might be able to solve this quickly.
  • But soon we will have feature X, Y and Z. Emile said so.

    I do wonder though what would have happened when Gmail had trashed all accounts after 2 years. After all, it was years and years in 'beta'. Some guys here think that it's a good excuse for not providing a stable solution.

    Facts is: every time we can read that "next month we will come closer to what's promised". In real life, every month we see more stuff breaking due to re-writes. Not upgrading to the next experimental is for many users not an option anymore as the (experimental) firmware running on their device is simply broken. They just HAVE to update and HOPE something is fixed.

    If Emile writes that we can expect "not everything 100% working" is kinda implies that at least 80% does. Currently al I want is Homey to do the basic things promised: play music on a wireless speaker, control my z-wave modules and infrared devices and actually recognize what I say. Count the things that are working a few months after I bought the device......
  • JonJon Backer - Super Early Bird
    @Arjan going from stable to experimental is easy. But switching back, that is that hardest part. (read: impossible so far!) 
    So yes, we are forced to stay in experimental once we've made the step. 
  • RamonBaasRamonBaas Backer - Geek Edition
    All, this message was directed @Emile. Please let him react.
  • BartOtten said:

    If Emile writes that we can expect "not everything 100% working" is kinda implies that at least 80% does.
    Do note that, even if on average 80% works, this could very well mean that for some people 100% works, for some people it's only 10% (and as you can read in the v0.10.0 thread, there are indeed people who report that everything is working fine and that this firmware actually is an improvement!). There are lots of different Homey configurations (with different combinations of apps, and different hardware that it has to control).
    On the other hand, even if 99% of the software would work correctly, that 1% could be such a annoying bug that it prevents 90% of the community from running their everyday tasks.

    Also note that a large part of this core rewrite wasn't about fixing previously known bugs. It was about creating a situation where, in the future, it would be a lot easier/faster for Athom to find and fix such bugs. I see it as a necessary evil, which will hopefully result in much faster improvements of the Homey firmware in the upcoming weeks/months.
  • RamonBaas said:
    All, this message was directed @Emile. Please let him react.
    Why shoult he react?
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