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[APP Z-Wave] NEO Coolcam Z-Wave devices - Main discussion topic

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  • MHubert said:
    Fire69 said:
    MHubert said:

    Last weekend ordered some Neo's plugs for €28,= and that's still a big price for some mass produced plastic and some small pcb's.
    @Phuturist had one explode on him when plugging it in, so there might be a small QC problem from the cheaper Chinese producers :P
    Thats why I said that its a still a high price for some mass produced stuff ;) 
    1 out of 5 defect;
    5 * €28 = €140
    €140 / 4 = €35

    Still way cheaper then the Fibaro's (€60-65) and the Neo's are Z-Wave+ :)
    https://www.amazon.de/Fibaro-FIBEFGMS-001-ZW5-5G-4-in-1-Multisensor/dp/B01CPR7VX4

    45€: ZWave+ /  Temp-coded led (if you want to use it) / Better waranty

    In the end, it won't make that much difference and you have less of a risk of burning down your house.

    Your choice ;)
  • MHubertMHubert Member
    edited December 2016
    Fire69 said:
    MHubert said:
    Fire69 said:
    MHubert said:

    Last weekend ordered some Neo's plugs for €28,= and that's still a big price for some mass produced plastic and some small pcb's.
    @Phuturist had one explode on him when plugging it in, so there might be a small QC problem from the cheaper Chinese producers :P
    Thats why I said that its a still a high price for some mass produced stuff  
    1 out of 5 defect;
    5 * €28 = €140
    €140 / 4 = €35

    Still way cheaper then the Fibaro's (€60-65) and the Neo's are Z-Wave+
    https://www.amazon.de/Fibaro-FIBEFGMS-001-ZW5-5G-4-in-1-Multisensor/dp/B01CPR7VX4

    45€: ZWave+ /  Temp-coded led (if you want to use it) / Better waranty

    In the end, it won't make that much difference and you have less of a risk of burning down your house.

    Your choice
    On this forum one Neo went bad?
    Deutch model also gives a risk on losing you money or making big costs when a module go bad. This when you need to send it back on your costs. The dutch webstores sell for €60-65,=

    Can somebody do a calculation of the chance more go bad?
  • Yes indeed I would not buy mains powered devices from China. They just put the CE mark on everything without actually meeting with the requirement. They are just too much risk. Battery operated stuffs a bit different. I have only Fibaro inline devices.  It is pity that homey and fibaro sensors have a very limited range. 
  • MHubert said:

    On this forum one Neo went bad?
    Deutch model also gives a risk on losing you money or making big costs when a module go bad. This when you need to send it back on your costs. The dutch webstores sell for €60-65,=

    Can somebody do a calculation of the chance more go bad?
    Sorry, my brains screwed up, I linked to the motion sensor :expressionless: 

    You're right, the Neo's are more interesting at first sight.  We'll just have to wait and see if they are reliable enough.

  • honeyhoney Member
    edited December 2016
    In my case a Fibaro sensor went bad. It has such rubbish bracket that it felt out when slammed the door. Since it is broken it can`t be returned (I am not alone with this). Add that to the bill.
  • How much shit is selled on MM, Kijkshop, Action, Lidl, Aldi, Xenos, etc. ?
    Someone can remember the Dutch article about bad USB chargers sold all over the place? The article strongly adviced people to not use them and in the end many 10.000 pieces are sold/used.... did the all explode? send all users it back? 

    Yes there's a risk, but I would not over react. 
    Also the well known and respected brands like Samsung, Apple, and also gasburners, electric cooking devices, wood-stoves, etc. etc.

    2 weeks after today I will have 7 Neo plugs and 1 floodsensor.
    Will report if one of them go bad.
  • PhuturistPhuturist Member
    edited December 2016
    Fire69 said:
    MHubert said:

    Last weekend ordered some Neo's plugs for €28,= and that's still a big price for some mass produced plastic and some small pcb's.
    @Phuturist had one explode on him when plugging it in, so there might be a small QC problem from the cheaper Chinese producers :P

    Fire69 said:
    MHubert said:

    Last weekend ordered some Neo's plugs for €28,= and that's still a big price for some mass produced plastic and some small pcb's.
    @Phuturist had one explode on him when plugging it in, so there might be a small QC problem from the cheaper Chinese producers :P
    Just to get the facts straight. It did not explode but short circuited when I pushed in a power chord of my washer resulting in a spark (which happens on short circuit). I have had that happen with regular cheap socket blocks as well.

    The risk of this happening is probably larger with Chinese devices but it's not like it's all crap. I use a lot of Chinese stuff in the house and overall I'm quite happy with the price/quality ratio.

    This is just bad luck, might of even happened with a Fibaro wall plug as I had limited space and might have forced it into it to much. Pretty sure this will not happen out of the blue so any extra risk on fire in the house is neglectable.

    Of course the choice is yours.


  • Keep in mind that some devices has high inrush current what is way much higher than the rated power. Use it for low power stuffs if you wish to be on the safe side. 
  • MHubertMHubert Member
    edited December 2016
    Current(ly) using one Neo for the GroheRed (rated; 2200W/10A, here; 230V/9.5A), where the NEO are rated 13A/230V.

    Working like a charm! 

    So on current there's 37% headroom.


  • MHubert said:
    Current(ly) using one Neo for the GroheRed (rated; 2200W/10A, here; 230V/9.5A), where the NEO are rated 13A/230V.

    Working like a charm! 

    So on current there's 37% headroom.


    The neo plug are 2000W Max so....
  • MHubertMHubert Member
    edited December 2016
    MHubert said:
    Current(ly) using one Neo for the GroheRed (rated; 2200W/10A, here; 230V/9.5A), where the NEO are rated 13A/230V.

    Working like a charm! 

    So on current there's 37% headroom.


    The neo plug are 2000W Max so....
    nope;
    On 110V its 1430W (110V*13A)
    On 230V its 2990W (230V*13A)
    Max current, so max power.

    Continuous power is a different story.
  • MHubert said:
    Continuous power is a different story.
    Exactly.

    And don`t just assume the 230V. In UK at many places we have >240V.
  • Sure continuous power is different.
    According to my colleagues (electrical engineers) it is max 13A or max 2000W what ever come's first.
    It will probably handle a max of 2200W but it can not handle a max of 2990W according to them.

    Im not a electrical engineer so im not gonna discus this further, just noticed it and want you guys to be careful.  o:)



  • Just received my power plugs... and installed them without any issues: thanx @m-ruiter!

    Given above discussion, I checked the power plug, box and manual...
    The power plug itself does not show the 2000W, nor does the box and manual.

    See below scan of the first 2 pages of the NEO Coolcam power plug (could not find it on the internet):

    So I don't know where the 2000W max is coming from; will inquire at the vendor...
     Just a side note: again on sale at Aliexpress (for the next 2 days):
  • Off-topic - If you curious how the Fibaro and NEO motion sensor looks inside than it is for you:
    https://forum.athom.com/discussion/2377/

  • The power plug itself does not show the 2000W, nor does the box and manual.




    It's not on the plug??
  • Hmm I don't trust it anymore, you manual says max 12A  :/ instead off 13A that's on the website. 
  • My plug doesn't has this colorful inlay sticker.
    Will try to disassemble one plug tonight.
  • Fire69 said:

    The power plug itself does not show the 2000W, nor does the box and manual.




    It's not on the plug??
    No. I will make a picture this evening. 
    I asked for a clarification from the vendor and manufacturer; still awaiting feedback...
  • Hmm I don't trust it anymore, you manual says max 12A  :/ instead off 13A that's on the website. 
    Yes, and 10A continuous... So what is it?  10, 12 or 13A?

    Gotta love those Chinese engineers :P
  • Mathijs said:
    While I appreciate a low price like everybody else, I am not sure we should promote ripoffs of well known products from Fibaro.
    Its not exactly the same, they did not have a patent on the round eye PIR design.
    So no problem what so ever and please go work at Apple... They do the patent bashing game real good.
  • @fire69 ; less risk....... No way.

    They passed all European certifications also the ones of the z-wave Alliance.
    The risk of a fibaro catching fire is as big as a neo.

    If so far just seen one plug that short circuited and the user confirmed that he had put some force on it to put his plug into it so i guess the metal that goes arround the pikkie of the plug bend or broke off.

    Seen many blown fibaro plugs on all kinds of forums this last year.
    Nevertheless, the design is so that a short circuit just gives a big bang and no fire.


  • :D And for the record, i don't hold Neo Coolcam shares :)

    I'm just the guy with the most plugs and sensors in NL

  • ZperXZperX Member
    edited December 2016
    mruiter said:
    Mathijs said:
    While I appreciate a low price like everybody else, I am not sure we should promote ripoffs of well known products from Fibaro.
    Its not exactly the same, they did not have a patent on the round eye PIR design.
    So no problem what so ever and please go work at Apple... They do the patent bashing game real good.
    Yeah apple wanted to patent the rounded rectangle shape. They lost. I would like to patent the cube shape. Could earn a lot of money.



  • mruiter said:

    :D And for the record, i don't hold Neo Coolcam shares :)

    I'm just the guy with the most plugs and sensors in NL

    Maybe at the moment, but I'm working on that  :p
    Got my PIR and water sensor today.
  • MHubertMHubert Member
    edited December 2016
    MHubert said:
    My plug doesn't has this colorful inlay sticker.
    Will try to disassemble one plug tonight.



    To me it looks like a very good module.
    The relay the used; 
    Hstp relais hf7520
    Relais is 16A max and 8A with a 0.4cos.
    Relais also looks very solid.

    Also looking at the 230V connects/soldering I can't see how this can be shorted.
    It should taken a lot of force to break things inside this.
  • a bad R16 (inrush current resistor) is enough to cause a nice spark

    the cheap version of the z-wave chip :smiley: 

    i so hope it's not 0.4 cosinus, that's HORRIBLE and kinda weird in such a small relay (1.0 = best, 0.0 = worst)

    and depending on what type it is (1C or 1A) it's a big difference with switching,
    1C: most likely the type used
    max  constant
    10A
    2500VA (not Watt!)


    1A:
    max constant
    16A
    4000VA (not Watt! wattage given = 300W but they probably meant 3000W)
  • @caseda ;
    It was @Phuturist who had the spike/shorting after applying a lot of force to the plug.
    Based on the solid soldering, connectors, etc. I conclude it should be A LOT force to break this.

    Is this is a horrible relay?

  • it's actually not even possible by using force unless you rotate your plug 90 degrees and then try to plug it in :dizzy: 
    even though there is a physical barrier (paper?) around 1 of the contacts. <= kinda weird

    i think it was just a bad part that is (was?) inside that blew up when the plug was inserted and let a flow of power go around in the module
    maybe something blocked the plug (the round capacitors could be bend infront of 1 of the plug pins
    but a little hard to say with just these photos :smiley: 

    the relay is ok, don't know the brand though, but hey, it's chinese :smiley: 
    it's more most likely rated for 2000-2200W for devices with motor(s) inside, newer washing machines are a little bit better with cosinus so i guess the newer washing machines (less then 2-3 years) you can go up to 2300-2400W
  • The barries around the contacts is a rigid plastic.

    Relay brand is HSTP (see pdf).

    for now one of these plugs is running great with our GroheRed 1800-1900W measured by the plug (2200W on paper).
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