Homey's software going Open Source?

JohanKuster

oh just a thought... It will speed up software development while Athom can work on Homey2 ;-)
https://opensource.com/business/16/6/7-myths-about-open-sourcing-your-companys-software

KoenMartens

With the amount of unknown competition from Amazon, Apple, Google, etc, I don't think it's a valid marketing idea for Homey to give away their source code.

JohanKuster

KoenMartens said:

With the amount of unknown competition from Amazon, Apple, Google, etc, I don't think it's a valid marketing idea for Homey to give away their source code.

Did u read the myhts?

Bumblez

Another myth is, that development of Homey would go faster, or that the firmware would quickly become more stable, if it were open source. More people editing the code, will have a high risk of adding more bugs, and it would require a significant amount of time from someone in charge (Emile?) to review all the changes that are made... which means he has less time to make changes himself.

So even if Athom were to consider this, I would advise against it at this point in time. Maybe in the distant future, once Homey has a stable and well working firmware version.

KoenMartens

JohanKuster said:

KoenMartens said:

With the amount of unknown competition from Amazon, Apple, Google, etc, I don't think it's a valid marketing idea for Homey to give away their source code.

Did u read the myhts?

Yes. Did you?

"Open sourcing your infrastructure/apps is giving your code away in hopes that someone else finds it useful. "

Other companies would LOVE homey's code. Athom's company is, quite bluntly, not worth too much (how many customers do they have? 2000-3000? Compare that to a Google's literally billions). The webpage says that the business is worth more than the code. This is not the case with Athom. Homey's code is worth more than Athom's business, at this moment.

Oh, and a website called "opensource.org" will not give unbiased information about open sourcing products.

mruiter

Will not happen....
They will keep there baby closed so no one can copy it.

Users are not even allowed to query the main log files . Emile already said the aren't going to disclose it because of competitors copying there ideas.

JohanKuster

KoenMartens said:

JohanKuster said:

KoenMartens said:

With the amount of unknown competition from Amazon, Apple, Google, etc, I don't think it's a valid marketing idea for Homey to give away their source code.

Did u read the myhts?

Yes. Did you?

"Open sourcing your infrastructure/apps is giving your code away in hopes that someone else finds it useful. "

Other companies would LOVE homey's code. Athom's company is, quite bluntly, not worth too much (how many customers do they have? 2000-3000? Compare that to a Google's literally billions). The webpage says that the business is worth more than the code. This is not the case with Athom. Homey's code is worth more than Athom's business, at this moment.

Oh, and a website called "opensource.org" will not give unbiased information about open sourcing products.

Read on.

Open sourcing your infrastructure/apps is giving your code away in hopes that someone else finds it useful...but also allows people to submit bug fixes and new features.

Why would other companies want Homey's code? Is it that special? How long would you think Google needs to create a Homey? Even if this code is so special...do you remember the Philips Video 2000 system. It was the best but it lost the battle. How about the battle between Google, Apple, Amazon and Homey?

By the way competitors can already copy code from Open Source automation projects like OpenHab or Domoticz.

Homey's code is its problem (let's hope it really is and not the hardware). If they don't produce a stable and full functional version fast, there soon will be no Athom and Homey. How long do you think they can survive without selling anything?

Hardware development is moving fast and they should already be working on a Homey2 but I doubt they have any time to spare. 

I don't want them to fail but I think they should look at every option to survive. The need to look at other business models also.

"opensource.org" is biased? Of course they are but not for financial reasons. Look around you, the world is moving to Open Source. Large companies move code to the Open Source communitie. I see companies moving to Open Source software. The company I work for is moving from AIX to Linux. All Big Data software they use is Open source etc. The force is strong ;-)

Panda

Keep in mind that Athom is a startup, not a full-fledged company like Apple, so no they aren't working on a Homey 2 and why would they. The current Homey is able to support almost every protocol out there.

As other have said, opensource won't speed up development of the Homey core it will only make it harder.

Open source isn't a magic solution for everything.

MarcoF

Whats the definition of a startup ?

swttt

MarcoF said:

Whats the definition of a startup ?

That could be a nice discussion  

Wikipedia:

A startup company (startup or start-up) is an entrepreneurial venture typically describing newly emerged, fast-growing business. Definition of the startup usually refers to a company, a partnership or an organization designed to rapidly develop scalable business model.[1] Often, startup companies deploy advanced technologies, such as Internet, communication, robotics, etc. These companies are generally involved in the design and implementation of the innovative processes of the development, validation and research for target markets.[2] The term became internationally widespread during the dot-com bubble when a great number of dot-com companies were founded.[3] 

Every person has his own definition.

I would consider a company a start-up if they want to create something (new) for the masses, and grow rapidly.

The next question could be when does a company stops being a start-up

MarcoF

Lets say the are past the start-up phase when the are shipping the pre-orders and so going retail in July 2016 in about 4 days

swttt

MarcoF said:

Lets say the are past the start-up phase when the are shipping the pre-orders and so going retail in July 2016 in about 4 days

And I would stop calling them a startup when they go retail, it turns out to be a success and they grow rapidly. 

JohanKuster

Panda said:

Keep in mind that Athom is a startup, not a full-fledged company like Apple, so no they aren't working on a Homey 2 and why would they. The current Homey is able to support almost every protocol out there.

As other have said, opensource won't speed up development of the Homey core it will only make it harder.

Open source isn't a magic solution for everything.

Why would the Raspberry PI foundation work on a Pi2..Pi3...wasn't the first one fast enough? Why would anybody bring out anything that is better than the current thing for the same price or less? I don't know, seems like a stupid idea and a wast of money but I would love to have a quad core Homey ;-)

Why wouldn't opensource speed up development? I don't get it. The core should have been finished a long time ago. You can tell or write down how the core should work. There are enough smart people who can build it.

2015 Linux Kernel Report:
What we’re learning from this year’s data is that there are more developers working on Linux than ever. More than 12,000 individuals have contributed to Linux since 2005 and more than 4,000 contributed in just the last 15 months. Nearly half of these recent developers are first-time contributors, which we think really represents the growing community of people supporting Linux.

Perhaps all of these factors - more first-time contributors and more paid developers - are contributing to how fast Linux is built. More than 1,300 changes are made per week. That’s nearly eight changes an hour, or two every 15 minutes. In fact, Linux kernel 3.15 was the busiest development cycle in the kernel’s history.

swttt

Don't forget how many people use Linux and how many homeys are shipped. Its comparing apples with pears

caseda

There was 2 years in between a finished raspberry pi 1 and version 2.
And another 2 years in between 2 and 3.
Homey is only out for like... 7 months now (not counting the pre-development, which isn't taken in consideration with the raspberry's as well), and way(!) more complicated then the raspberry pi.
And, homey is still in development, so not an actual finished product like the pi 1 was at the time.
Why start on a new device, if your first one isn't even finished yet..

But if you want to compare to anything even a little bit close:
I don't see the core software of a google home, apple siri or amazon echo laying around.
And they by far don't have all the capabilities homey has.
And these companies don't even try to bother to get all wireless technologies together like athom is trying now.
Which is this very exact same reason why athom is keeping the core of homey closed.

And coming back at what you said before... 

Open sourcing your infrastructure/apps is giving your code away in hopes that someone else finds it useful...but also allows people to submit bug fixes and new features.

So we aren't introducing "new features" with every new app that is published in the app store?
And aren't submitting bug fixes with every log we send, even though it is indirect?
Then it must be me..